Comments (Page 479)

Well Alex Garland has many good films, but aren't those more or less cult movies? He does good movies and I am waiting for Annihilation, but does what to make an Alien movie? Does del Toro?

I for one agree that the Xenomorph is cook, but also think Covenant was burn out of severe lack of imagination.

dk - That painting is one of my favs as well.

BigDave - My pleasure...

sherris - Indeed, the possibilites are endless.

'I just hope it is an evolved world and we can get some stunning visuals to speak about.'

We would like to see the same universe, beyond doubt.

Thank you for the comments.

Those points echo sentiments on this forum almost verbatim.

Yeah have to agree, Scott's latest comments have been pretty low and uninspiring for such a renowned visionary director. His prequels do need closure however, so maybe go out with a bang for one last film then time for a shake up and new direction perhaps? 

Alex Garland hell yes!!

Why don't we have a podcast here on Scified?? Has anyone looked at it i wonder....

I really hope that the Planet they choose to go to be it Origae 6 or some other place. I just hope it is an evolved world and we can get some stunning visuals to speak about.  The chances of it being anpther sesolate world are, although "very Alien" are getting to the point i want some crazy advanced Elders world or better still the Elders creators world. Now that qould be nice. These beings have trascended their bodies and are made up of gasses and hardware. using servants to carry out the commands.

Little day dream there... back to reality

Ahhhh........

Those endless possibilities.............

Lovely set of images. very impressive and could fit right in. they got my vote

@ Critters5,

"I think unless a Fanboy gets to direct an Alien movie we will always get material that is missing the mark and shallow."

This has already happened it was called Aliens, and look at how some of the fans treat that movie. It could have happened again with Neill Blomkamp.

Do you think Ridley reads editorials like this to take the pulse of his fanbase? 

Sadly Bigdave I think the mural is just an easter egg. I think we as fans look much further into all of these topics than even the writers and director do. I think unless a Fanboy gets to direct an Alien movie we will always get material that is missing the mark and shallow. 

Guys, I am posting here again after reading Chris's post where Sir Ridley said the Engineers did not create us, or the Xenomorph.  He mentioned the ones above the Engineers (The Creators of the Humans) could manipulate weather patters & cause natural disasters?  Maybe they caused the silica storm on LV-223 & created the weather around Planet 4, as well?

I heard that too....

The Mural in Prometheus that is, one rumor was that as they had toned down the Xenomorph DNA in Prometheus with the Trilobite/Deacon being the only real links that people may get. It is rumored that the Mural designs was only as a Easter Egg to the Xenomorph and HR Giger works to appease fans.

This (IF TRUE) shows FOX  have completely not got  a clue what they are doing, because in a Movie so Vague and Ambiguous, a movie that many fans wanted to see how it connects to a Alien Prequel.... The MURAL and Frescos were something interesting that many people would be looking at for clues.

If they are just a case of..... "ok well lets put something cool  and Alien Related in as a Easter Egg" purely because it looks Cool and for no other reason, then a lot of theories which include most of mine are then completely NULL

A Easter Egg is using the Aspen Beer  and for a series of Alien Prequels, putting anything in which could Genetically link to the Xenomorph/Giger Aesthetic are just giving Fans Red Herrings.

These EASTER EGGS if you would, actually provided great Topics to Debate for theories and potential ideas how the Franchise can expand... but ALAS if all they are is COOL Easter Eggs and they had no meaning and FOX are intending to not cover them... as they dont exist apart from looking COOL then it Sadly shows FOX and those working on the Movies have not got a CLUE.

Some Easter Eggs are ok to use, like the Chicken Burster HR Giger First Chest Buster Concept, with which David has a Organism he experimented with in his Work Shop that is a Prop made based on HR Gigers Concepts.

Some are just Stupid to use, we see in Davids Workshop the Bio-Mechanical Xeno, Classic Egg and Face Hugger, these for those with KEEN eyes could mean the Classic Xenomorph has already been encountered and studied by David....   but alas it appears they felt lots of the Concept works done by the team would LOOK cool if they was in Davids workshop..   There even is Dane Hallets very Mechanical Looking Xenomorph esque Concept work.

However the one on the right made it into Davids Workshop and so looks less Mechanical.

The Problem FOX set themselves up with is by adding pieces of Work into the Movie or Marketing that are intended to have no bearing or connection at all but to LOOK COOL when all they do is be taken as clues by some fans or even build up expectations of something Grand... when in reality this is far from the Truth.

I am sure everyone remembers this POSTER?

Which Ultimately had nothing to do with Alien Covenant, but still keeps some fans hopping this kind of Scene happened in the past or could happen in the FUTURE and hopefully either could be referenced in future movies.

But in reality it could just be we will never see this, it is just a COOL Art piece that has Xenomorph type Organisms and Engineer Type Humanoids, and has no bearing at all on the PLOT.

Those themes are interesting BigDave but we will likely only get a short second flute scene to touch on them. 

I hope Tennesse is killed off, I hated his shell of a character. 

I just at this point really think Ridley will get funding for one film and that film will feel even more rushed than AC with a lackluster connection to Alien 1. I think we keep getting our hopes up that Ridley still has Alien 1 quality up his sleeve but I don't think he does. I think Awakening will be more of the same. 

Something else: Have you noticed the snowy mountain in the distance (second image)? Doesn't that imply an earthlike climate? We know that the crew of Prometheus couldn't breathe outside the ship, but they could inside the temple. The engineers had some kind of terra-forming device inside the temple, but it was open towards the climate outside (the outer door was open).

I agree until they end up in a director's cut I don't consider them canon. Cuts down on the confusion. Such a shame Alien does not have the same level of care taken with it as Star Wars. 

Looks very interesting, i will have to try and check it out, thanks for the Share, we can certainly see many influences to the Alien Franchise in not only visuals but soundtrack etc too

Unfortunately my Computer is too old to play this Game :(

I heard the mural was a props to Giger and nothing more meaningful. 

Thanks for the Share....

Some very interesting pieces here, i can see many fit in with what looks like a group of Human explorers discovering a number of different worlds in various stages of Civilization/Technological Evolution. Prometheus opened up the Franchise, to allow us to ponder how many other Worlds had the Engineers Seeded and what Level of Technology could these other Humanoids had evolved too.

The problem that has happened ali81 is with each movie, they come up with new ideas and changes in direction, which then contradict with what previous movies seemed to lay out.   The same thing happens with their Background information etc.

Indeed there was a Extra on the DVD that showed the company was aware of the Signal, but also in the Prometheus Marketing they made the Weyland Industries website, that also contained information about the discovery of Acheron LV-426 a moon in the Zeta 2 Reticuli system that seemed to show signs this system could support life and the Company intends to send a Mission there within the next Century (the date of the discovery i think was 2034 or 2038) well in that Ball Park.

However this site also had a history of the David Model from David 1 in the year 2025 to David 8 in the year 2072 (i think) But FOX have removed the Weyland Site and so this is a sign that those clues left are no longer considered Canon as they contradict the Path ALIEN COVENANT has taken...  Which appears to be that David 8 is actually DAVID 1 and so the same thing applies to the DVD Extras... that show the company had detected the Space Jockey Signal...

We have to consider things on the extras as not being 100% Canon, because they can be changed in the direction the Prequels will be going.

Its a Shame really because RS had 100% explained the Space Jockey event in a number of comments, his latest one way prior to the sequel he even gave exact details... but it appears they have decided its more interesting if DAVID created the Xenomorph.

I can give details of what Ridley Scotts Space Jockey explanation was if any one wants it?

Ali, I think its the latter. Fox is all about $ and it seems like plot wise Alien is flying from the seat of its pants. 

@Gavin

Some interesting ideas, and we cant 100% rule out them going back to something more HR Giger and something related to the Plot of the Starbeast, but only maybe as far as revealing some Race/Species that are Aesthetically related to the Xenomorph but appearing to be different.  But we  dont know how much of a Plan FOX/RS had when they worked on Alien Engineers and how Different the Plan or idea is now.  For example the Mural and Frescos in Prometheus, revealing a relationship between Engineers and very HR Giger/Xenomorph Atheistic beings.

Regarding what happens when a Xenomorph dies, it did make a Cabbage Patch post before showing how a Patch can look like Rows of Xenomorph Eggs, but then mentioned how Cabbages Procreated and how it would be very ALIEN if they explored a similar route with the Xenomorph.   Basically any part of  a Cabbage that falls to a fertile ground will Rot Away and from its remains will spring forth New Cabbages.  So they kind of have a revolving Life-Cycle, and this could incorporate into the Xenomorph...

so when they Die, there Bodies would start to degenerate but from the material would sprout New Eggs.  And so even when they naturally die, there bodies would dissolve and from this New Egg/Eggs would grow.  Making them very much like Cabbages.  This would make them very ideal Bio-Weapons because it would negate the need for a Egg Morph, and Queen but they could still exist, and indeed the Process that the Xenomorph goes through when it dies to Evolve into a Egg, could be used to infect other Organic Life and Evolve them into Eggs..

The End Result would mean if the Xenomorph had a limited Life Span, we could see say 25 Xeno Eggs be able to infect say 25 hosts and then say Egg Morph say 50 other Hosts so we have 50 Eggs, but then if the Xenomorphs when they reach the end of their cycles they too evolve into Eggs... means that after a initial 25 Egg shipment to a area, after a period of time we end up with NO Xenomorphs but 75 Eggs.

I remember making this post a long time ago, way prior to Alien Covenant, but when we see Alien Covenant and the Spores, indeed its something that could fit with the suggestions i made in that CABBAGE PATCH Topic, that a dying Xenomorph decomposes and Spores Grow from the remains that can infect Hosts.

@Critters5

I cant find the original Star Beast but the first incarnations of ALIEN are pretty much the same, i will post a link below... this Alien is different to the latter versions that became the movie and it is near enough the same as the earlier Star Beast, well i am pretty sure its almost the same.

Alien Star Beast

@Cristian

I do think if RS is able to complete his ideas and if we do get to see more movies than the TWO more prequels to ALIEN, that we will find out about the Creators of the Engineers i think we will see a Hierarchy above them or at least have this mentioned in the next two movies, but these may be very related to the Engineers.  I feel RS has a idea of some Race/Thing/Being/Power or Machine more at the Top of the Hierarchy it will be interesting if they are still on the same idea with this and if we ever will see it.  I feel at very least their is one Element above the Engineers which we will be introduced to or have it mentioned, but again i am not sure how much more Alien these will be and i would assume they would look Engineer/Human still.

As far as Biblical Connections, RS was also looking at other Mythos too, but the Question now is if we will explore the Hierarchy/Creators in any context we can associate with Religions and Mythos as Prometheus seemed to be more or less LOOSELY touching on this things more in the Ancient Astronaut theory way.

BigDave, I absoloutely love the idea of Starbeast so much more than Alien. Is there a book of Starbeast? 

Hi!

A visionary opinion, according to me. I thinm that we will never know who made engeneers (probably). As for now I'd like to see why do they want to destroy humans and who's their leader.

I am seriously interested in having this answer also because seems like R. Scott got insipred by the Bible, which is pratically the same story of Prometheus (but without Aliens)

that prince alien would be one lucky SOB. all that tail on a plate lol

Michelle Johnston

Well, all three of RS’s Alien-films (Alien, Prometheus and AC) have roughly the same plot or structure: Message (in Prometheus the cave painting) - investigate - problem starts - chaos (everybody dies) - monster is defeated (in Prometheus the engineer) - heroine survives (in AC there was a twist at the end so she will likely be dead in the next one - just as Shaw). Alien: Awakening will probably not have a similar plot (although nearly all films have The Three Act Structure). We (the fans) need one more movie to connect the whole shebang to Alien. I hope they’ll think this one through carefully before starting the project . . .

This is actually somewhat similar to an old theory of mine which I created to answer a flaw in the Xenomorphs allocated form of propagation, to answer the question of what happens when the Xenomorph runs out of viable hosts. Presumably, they would wither and die, leaving behind their eggs. My theory was as such...

If we look at the Drone (Alien, Alien 3) as an infertile male of the species, and look at the Warrior (Aliens) as an infertile female, and the Queen as a fertile female, could there be a fertile male of the Xenomorph species, AKA the King. I postulated that once indigenous hosts became scarce the Queen of each hive created up to that point would sire a lone fertile male in the usual fashion. The adolescent/juvenile version of this new breed AKA Prince Alien would then meet and fight other Princes in the vicinity, to the death, until only one remained. Upon victory, the Prince would then be set upon en-masse by the Drones and Warriors from the nearby hives, which by vibrating their bodies would generate insane amounts of body heat forcing the Prince to molt into its adult form, the King.

With a King born the Queens from each of the neighboring hives would then surround the King, taking turns to copulate with the beast before returning back to their nurseries within the hives. Inseminated with the Kings seed the Queens would then be able to produce a new strain of egg in addition to the traditional Facehugger eggs, within which would have been a sub-species that was the opposite of the Xenomorph (soft skinned, intelligent) that the Xenomorphs would then use as hosts, allowing the hive to continue.

Originally I imagined this sub-species would be the Predators, who would use the Xenomorph to hunt as a rite of passage into adulthood. And to further the symbiotic relationship between the two I imagined that the Predators would be sterile, needing the Alien to produce more 'Predator eggs' to sustain their numbers and continue as a species. But with the AvP movies having performed so poorly, and with the birth of the prequel series and the Engineers I could easily imagine the Engineers in their place.

So it took longer than expected but I finally clocked this game. The classic isometric gameplay throughout the game is unreal and visually stunning, a lot of thought and research was put into creating a fantastically claustrophobic environment onboard a dying ship. The gameplay itself is limited and at times a little vague on its own psychics about what you can and cannot do. But the strength of this game is in its setting, plot and character drama.

The story and characters! Suburb. First rate. Disturbingly dark and almost as nihilistic as Alien 3, it doesn't shy away from tragedy and despair. A lot of the backstory is told through dead character PDA's but you quite literally feel and see what the inhabitants of the Groomlake endured as the ship descended into chaos around them. 

There are several subtle and not-so-subtle references to Alien throughout the game. One I had to laugh at was a shit-kicker character you find dead and eviscerated called Burke Carter.....    

I get where ur coming from with the derelict not being old and the fact there are thousands of eggs in its hold and thousands of colonists on the covenant. but then id refer to the weyland files stating a signal on lv426 which comes from the derelict even before the Prometheus expedition. so which is it u think? is the derelict really thousands of years old or r fox just putting anything into their dvd's with the attitude 'lets just sell dvd's and f**k continuity'? I think we the fan deserve better than this.

Ridley's first idea for the xeno was that it became an intelligent sentient being. during its early stage it is a highly aggressive species but after some time, it evolves and becomes a species capable of communication, living in social structures and using technology. whether we see this come true or not is another thing but that's not to say the original (the one in the mural) wasn't an intelligent and highly evolved species.

I like all of them but am partial to the 4th one. It looks like the earth is starting to reclaim its area.

red0guy & Chili

We are shifting the point around here. The essential point I was making is the crafting of the characters in Covenant was nicely done and for me had a sense of authenticity. However they were deliberately put on a retread repeat journey. Message, divert, stuff happens, face hug, chest burst, all die and Xeno blown into space. So Orams behaviour is equally as stupid as Kane's. The difference is we know much more than we did the first time so the second time the character looks stupid. This is course old ground the characters in Alien do just as many stupid things its just novel... which is precisely why you can not keep on making the same film over and over again. 

Peter Weyland is due ex machina to get the whole story going mad, hubristic, delusional and that creates an environment where a lot of chancers and a damaged Elizabeth go off in search of our creators. The reprocessing of the story and having a  young man play an old man was unfortunate.

Caring I didn't care about the crew of the Nostromo, I am not sure I cared about Deckard and probably do not care about K but goodness me I was/am interested in what they mean and their journey because its an interesting one, one that is not altogether clear and of course Ripley grew changed and sacrificed herself, there is a emotional thread which builds up on loyalty and yet people compare that journey to the mechanical, by the numbers, moustachioed caricatured villain that David has become.    

IRaptus

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oShTJ90fC34

:)

The emissary arrives at the elder's quarters just in time to deliver his message, right before the ancient Engineer gets engaged in his daily out-of-body contemplative phase, a highly productive mental state halfway between sleep and creative thinking that he would not dare disturb. The young disciple, whose name is Tomik, approaches the elder with reverence and kneels down before him. He is not allowed to look directly into his eyes. He is a high priest and the head of the Elder's Council, which is largely responsible for the Engineers dealings with their subspecies.
"Dear Lord Vogut, I am here to inform you that, as it has been predicted, one of the creatures (a female) has survived after spending some time on our quarantined outpost. She hijacked one of our vessels with the help of an artificial intelligence. She has just arrived and is already in custody".
"What condition is she in?"
"She has been connected to the vessel's matrix. Her DNA has been recombined."
"Is she stable?"
"We need to conduct tests. Needless to say, she can be dangerous. However, the the symbiotic relationship with the vessel has been established. Eggs have been detected in the underbelly of the Cargo bay."
"These eggs... are they viable for human incubation? Or are they more of the same."
"We won't know until a host is in the vicinity".
"We have plenty of subjects from both species".
"I am inclined to select my own son, Remek. He is a fine specimen and will be willing to sacrifice himself for a good cause".
"Your wishes will be prioritized. However, you should know I have been working very hard to be given the opportunity to serve".
"The Council will deliberate and the best candidate will be selected. You are dismissed now".

Lord Vogut tries to establish a mental connection with the female earthling, but there is not much he is able to make out other than very vague and primitive feelings of anger and fear. He wonders if any communication and understanding would be even possible at all.

Shaw experiences another flashback- the time when she first encountered the Engineer. The Prometheus crew relied on David to interpret its words but understands everything being said now. The cryo pod must have altered her brain to a degree to where she understood their language. She begins to wonder how much that cryo pod changed her. It altered her physically and now, at least partially neurologically.

David still does not understand the language. “Dr. Shaw, I do not understand what these beings are saying.” The Engineer behind David gazes at him curiously and approaches David head on. It grasps David’s head and palpates the entire head. It applies a quick and forceful yet slight twist to David’s head. Shaw has a flashback at the same time fearing for the worst.

The Engineer releases its grasp and looks back at Shaw. “Tell it to speak.”

Shaw tells David, “David, say something.”

David replies, “Something.”

Shaw smiles with surprise and notices that his mouth works in unison with his speech.

Clad in their organically moulded suits and elephantine helmets the tall figures strolled confidently into the cavernous room. Imposingly large and threateningly lithe for such bulky creatures, Dr Shaw flinches backwards as they approach.

The two Engineers flanking the centre figure cut away, one heading for David, the other for her. The lone Engineer surveyed the room, tilting its head. A lost Juggernaut ship returned to its home, helmed by a human and a Synthetic. She could not fathom what this figure thought of that.

The Engineer approaching her came to a stop before her, then circled once as if inspecting her. Its giant shadow blocked the dim light as it passed around her. It finally settled in a guard position behind her. She shuddered.

The other Engineer had reached David and placed a hand on his shoulder. It turned and nodded subtly to the lone Engineer.

The Elephantine helmet slid back and down from the lone Engineers head, folding away neatly into slits around the suits collar. A bald head, handsome chiselled face with all-black eyes turned its gaze on Shaw. The Engineer almost appeared friendly if not for hard critical look in its eyes.

The blank look returned to Davids face, a puppet once again.  

"This one called itself David in mockery of your people's best creators. You erased him." came the words from David's unmoving mouth, as the lone Engineers gaze burnt down on her.

"Please. I have questions." she begged. It ignored her plea.

"If he is David, then I am BigDavid. You will not erase me" it mocked.

(Sorry I couldn't help myself but to give a nod to you BigDave)

The Engineer behind pushed her roughly forward.

cafam2000

'Ben Rigby - Deserves to be a lot more famous than he is. He completely sold the med bay scene because he scared the hell out of me.'

I totally agree with you. He is very good in all of his scenes. Look at his face when he informs us that he needs to visit the toilet. Awesome!

I think this is worth a Bump.... i was going to start a Thread, but then its taking up Space on the Site, and who needs Up-votes ;)

Indeed it is interesting that we see Female Engineers, the Fact with closer inspection of Davids Workship drawings with translations of the hand writing we see that not only are there Female Engineers, but there are Infants which means they could Procreate.

This does bring the Question of why the Sacrificial Scene, or did this merely lead to those Engineers?

Adding Females and Procreation does change the Direction set by Jon Spaights in which the Engineers had Evolved themselves past Procreation and had to find other means to create Life.

While on the Subject of Female Engineers,  and maybe Females in General, i was going to make a New Topic to discus these Concept Works, by Wayne Haagg and Steve Messing, both of the Cathedral Dome Doors, which both feature depictions of Humanoids who are not like the Engineers, but one is very Sumerian Style and the Other Biblical/Greek.   The Biggest Thing of Importance appears to be FEMALES on the Doors.

What i would give to pick their brains for the reasons behind those similar designs on the Doors/Entrance, and why the Females?  Surely not Coincidence both designed the Cathedral and placed None Engineer looking Humanoids, or the relevance of Females?

The answer is obvious: REVEAL THE MYSTERY!